Documentation of "CJ-7 Project"

[RuffRider]

I thought I was the only 1 who can't post pics....lol

[CORE 4WD]

Sign up at photodump.com. It's free. Re-size pics on your computer to about 25%. Upload using photodump and then highlight and copy the "img" section above pic. Click back to TWFW thread and paste.

[CORE 4WD]

fifesjeep said:

core 4wd you kick a$$, thanks man!

Actually, I kinda suck at that stuff-jeepingoose taught me that one! Just passing on the knowledge. By the way, no pics were dropped into your post...

[Chele]

Nice pics......might want to resize them to about 650 pixels though!!! That way they don't scroll off the page!

[4WDnRocksNmud]

www.irfanview.com/

resize the pics to roughly 600x450.

actually, when you resize them, if you just hit 600 in the first box, the program maintains the proper aspect ratio. it's pretty cool.

[XJames]

This is a pic of MY GOBBER GREEN RIP 304 Before break-in period

Dude that motor looks mean as he11. I would hate to see you get that dirty. What you going to do with the old spring?

[A "CJ"]

Looks like the engine is out, might want to think about putting some weight over that front axle to get the suspension to set down or wait to install the spring perches permanently to keep steering geometry correct.
Center of gravity might be a factor as well.

www.rockstomper.com/catalog/wheels/beadlocks.htm

[mrautoparts]

If you need CJ parts I have several I'm parting out. Just pm me if you need something. Good luck on your project.

[Chuck]

Question -- why the extra travel arms? They improve your ramp score, but that's the only advantage to them, they do almost nothing to actually improve your traction. As soon as that arm drops off the supporting bump stop, that wheel stops doing anything useful even if it's touching the ground, because there's zero weight on it other than it's own self weight. It's great if you're building a ramp queen or a show truck, but pretty useless offroad, and it'll end up costing you more because (in addition to the driveshaft difficulties) you're also going to have to add a rear track arm to the suspension -- with that sort of setup, the leaf springs will no longer center your axle under the vehicle properly. Just something to consider.

With the angled shock, the ratio is actually 1.414 if the shock is at 45* when the vehicle is at rest at normal ride height. In other words, about 1.5" of wheel travel will cause 1" of compression in the shock. This is a progressive rate setup, so as the spring compresses the shock travel and force decrease -- in other words, the farther the suspension compresses, the weaker the shock gets. Angling the shock that way also increases the force on the shock by the same ratio (about 1.5:1), which makes any shock mounted that way behave exactly like a shock that's only 2/3 as stiff mounted vertically -- so you may need stiffer shocks to get the job done -- something to factor in when you're getting your shocks. If you're re-using your current shocks and they work well now, you may well find that you're underdamped when the new suspension is done, and the vehicle will tend to pogo-stick around a little on the road (not fun).

Have you looked at how you want to mount a rear anti-wrap bar yet? That's a suspension piece I'd strongly recommend if you're doing a flexy spring-over behind a very torquey engine, otherwise I give your new driveshaft (and possibly pinion gear) one, maybe two wheeling trips before they're toast. That's a lesson a lot of the Bronco guys have learned the hard and expensive way ... but it's easy to fix. A front anti-wrap may even be a good idea, if you can find the space to fit it.

Most of the folks around here recommend Gregory's and Standard Parts for driveshafts. Both have a great reputation, and either can make you a custom shaft to your specs. We've dealt with Standard and been satisfied, plus their main business is shafting for dump trucks and semis, so a little shaft like we all usually need is almost trivial for them to do. ::grins::

[Deleted]

Agreed. That design on the travel arms will not allow it to work any better when wheeling because there will be no downforce on the wheels when extended. As Chuck stated above, it's a good poser setup. I'd also be concerned with side to side axle movement. Even so, that's some nice work on building those arms.

[Deleted]

You kind of answered your own question. As soon as the travel arms come off the frame, that extra travel is useless because there won't be any downforce. It might look neat, but it will serve no purpose. You'd be better off having the wheel in the air on that side. I don't believe have a tire even resting on the ground would do any more. I don't think shocks will provide downforce, they just dampen movement, they never support any weight. If you go to pirate or the JU forum, there's a company out there that made something slightly similar. It's been discussed many times and determined the only usefullness is the neat factor on the RTI ramp and to show a new part to your friends. Chuck the engineer can probably describe and provide better answers as to why than I can. I also think with that setup, your axle would have a tendancy to walk side to side on the road and make it feel funny. Your two mounting points are at the front of the spring and close to the middle of the spring. That leaves a lot of spring in the rear to move around. You'll almost need a panhard bar I'd think, which would prevent all the extra articulation you've worked to achieve. I'd also be concerned with bending the springs with that much flex. Someone may prove me wrong on the last concerns though, that's just what popped into my mind.

[BIG J]

have you ever seen a revolver shackle unload going down a hill? not pretty.

[Chuck]

Alright, advantage:
- Looks cool on an RTI ramp.

Disadvantages:
- No added traction from a revolver/drop arm setup
- Unstable on the road without a track arm, and a good sideways hit without a track arm is likely to tear up your drop arms.
- Unstable on the trail if it unloads unexpectedly
- Extra flex for no reason creates major driveline problems -- you'll either end up spending a fortune on driveshafts to get a good high angle driveline, or you'll end up spending a fortune replacing broken ones ...

Different is good, but right now rigged up super-flexy suspensions using revolver shackles or drop arms fall under the "different just like everybody else" category. Unless the spring itself is compressed, there is no force on the tire, so a wheel laying on the ground with an arm dropped and no weight on it is doing about the same amount of work as the same wheel would be doing if it were two feet in the air. The difference is, now you have several times the stress on the driveshaft, so when the other rear wheel (which does have the entire weight of the rear end on it) gets traction, your U-joint snaps. You can snap a U-joint this way with a 2.5L four banger, you don't even need a big V8 for it. ::grins::

I'll take better lockers over flex any day. Lots cheaper, and lots less broken driveshafts ... and you still end up getting there ...

[Sticks]

Ever see the Skyjacker Mono-leaf setup?

[Sticks]

www.fourwheeler.com/techarticles/29318/